UPDATED 21.00hrs GMT
This from the inbox, giving us the 'official' text:-
Wednesday February 18, 2009
Eclipsers,
We are sure that you have noticed that the sale of Eclipse Aviation is taking longer than
expected. The efforts of many people to finalize the sale of Eclipse to EclipseJet is still
on course but slower than we all had hoped for. Even with the difficult financial markets
around the world, all actions to date allow us to believe that the sale and closing of the
overall process is well within reach. In spite of this optimism, we now find it prudent to
take action to provide us the best possible chance of assuring a sale closing occurs.
We are sure that you have noticed that the sale of Eclipse Aviation is taking longer than
expected. The efforts of many people to finalize the sale of Eclipse to EclipseJet is still
on course but slower than we all had hoped for. Even with the difficult financial markets
around the world, all actions to date allow us to believe that the sale and closing of the
overall process is well within reach. In spite of this optimism, we now find it prudent to
take action to provide us the best possible chance of assuring a sale closing occurs.
To make the company’s remaining cash last as long as possible and give us the most time
to complete the sale, the Board of Directors directed management to furlough essentially
all of the company’s employees effective today. This means you can go home and unless
you are asked, you should not report to work starting tomorrow, Thursday February 19,
2009, until further notice.
to complete the sale, the Board of Directors directed management to furlough essentially
all of the company’s employees effective today. This means you can go home and unless
you are asked, you should not report to work starting tomorrow, Thursday February 19,
2009, until further notice.
You will receive Thursday’s paycheck as normally distributed for work through Saturday,
February 14, 2009. It is our intention that all benefit coverage will remain in full effect.
We regret the need to take this action but we ask that you see the necessity given the
circumstances. You will be contacted at your home address and/or by home phone to
notify you when to return to your job or to provide any additional updates.
February 14, 2009. It is our intention that all benefit coverage will remain in full effect.
We regret the need to take this action but we ask that you see the necessity given the
circumstances. You will be contacted at your home address and/or by home phone to
notify you when to return to your job or to provide any additional updates.
While this is unpleasant and hopefully short lived, we are very thankful for all of the
ongoing support you are giving to Eclipse Aviation. We hope to have good news to
report to you in the coming days.
ongoing support you are giving to Eclipse Aviation. We hope to have good news to
report to you in the coming days.
Roel Pieper
Mark Borseth
Michael McConnell
Mark Borseth
Michael McConnell
The signs (behind the scenes) have been getting steadily worse for the past 10 days or so, with a number of missed deadlines in the Chapter 11 sales process. In the past few days, Roel has also gone 'walkabout', despite the crisis at the company. Various financial types have been deeply involved, trying to plot a way forward. I'd love to say more but I won't because today we need to think about the staff, their families and the supplier community.
I think I can speak for all of us 'critics' that this event, although long predicted, is not one that gives anyone a feeling of joy. My heart goes out to the breadwinner heading home to tell loved ones of hard times and disrupted lives and to the homemaker already struggling to stay upbeat in trying times.
One of the 'Honor Roll' has already offered help with those seeking jobs. I post his 'special purpose' address here, and will be happy to do so for others who's bona fides I'm happy with.
ColdWetMack@gmail.com
Coldwet (well known to all of 'us') is a solid professional, who will do all he can in the situation.
Every cloud has a silver lining, even if it seems bleak at present. Some suppliers are also in a very bad place, but can now at least move forward with other projects. Finally, it's almost inevitable that the next step will see the remaining stakeholders (owners, depositors and investors/lenders) left with little to feel cheerful about.
At least the speculation is coming to an end. One way or the other, this matter draws to a close.
Shane
549 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 401 – 549 of 549I've said it before, I know Jim and Vern - they are a lot alike in some ways but I believe Jim when he says he never meant to defraud anybody.
It is not conceivable to me that after $2B raised, and owing $1B, calling for progress payments on 600 or so planes, continuing to sell planes as best as they could, etc., that it was not obvious to Vern at some point, McConnell as well, and certainly RiP.
Thanks CW,
A pint 'o Guiness?
(or a new cork for my ERcoupe? .)
Say- You're not accusing Eclipse of being a RiP-Off, are you ?!?
-----------------------------------
(okay, that's my attempt at the "zinger of the day"...)
Two of the finer things in life (about the same pedigree timeline as well...:)
Guinness
ERcoupe
(Note the opto-mechanical fuel management system, just ahead of the ah, magneto-fluid geophysical sensor).
Whytech,
Note how the complexion of the blog has changed as the Eclipse fate has become more certain. Two years ago there was a question as to whether the patient would survive. Today the topics are more likely mourners reading the deceased’s will, pathology, forensics, malpractice and the undertaker.
Hard to believe anyone would put up much money for an Eclipse 500 now unless they considered it a disposable airplane… just a way to build some jet time and fly a bunch of raw-data approaches. The rest of the family should probably be left at home, but it could be a good way to take flying buddies for a hundred dollar hamburger. The immediate challenge will be getting type rated and insured. Better start scrounging around for spares and put them in the back of the hangar.
If the promise of the fully integrated avionics system had been fulfilled on time, the other limitations of the Eclipse might have been overlooked by enthusiasts. But now the partially functional Eclipse 500 stands in the shallow end of the gene pool of very light jets. Too short on range, payload, cabin size and ramp appeal.
Eclipse had a head start but blew the lead. The Mustang was started later, finished sooner, delivered in quantity, and is available for the same kind of money. Even if sold by Textron, Cessna will be around to support the product.
Meanwhile the blog soldiers on… with skilled observers scrutinizing a slow motion train wreck. We’ll continue the hear how little fuel the Eclipse burns – right up to the point when the last Eclipse has burned the last drop of Jet-A.
Ken (Liar) Meyer said...
Quit proposing your opinions as if they're established facts.
You mean, like calling me Mike?
Sorry, Ken, you don't set the ground rules here, and you certainly aren't adhering to this concept of "established facts" with your posts.
I enjoy this blog for the smart people but the incessant arguing about who said what has quickly taught me who's post to read.
I built a company from the basement in an emerging technology (industrial laser material processing) which was full of Wedge type promoters hyping the best new thing and how great and well it worked. I learned that I only made money if I bought parts and systems from companies that had been in business awhile and had a proven reputation of standing behind their work. so If I wanted a laser that had great Hype and specs I bought the new up proven laser from an unproven company If I wanted to make money I bought the proven equipment from good proven companies with proven support.
if you want an airplane that works and can make you money buy a Cessna or Beachcraft etc.
I found you can only work with proven facts and as far as I know there still is not one FIKI certified EA500 out there. We can argue all day if it is EASA certified as it cannot be used in commercial use in Europe.
this blog is full of ridiculous arguments based on conjecture.
Lets keep to the facts not unsavory name calling.
Mike (Flyger) Ciholas wrote, "Ken (Liar) Meyer said..."
Well, you're the one who picked a phony name, not me. I use my real name 'cause I'm not embarassed about who I am.
Anyhow, obviously I pegged you right, otherwise you wouldn't react so vigorously. I suppose it would be a real bummer to be discovered to be Mike Ciholas hiding behind a goofy moniker.
Perhaps now you'll tell the blog the rest of your story--your close connection to the Mustang program--so I'm not the only one who understands the origins of your special interest in Eclipse bashing.
Ken
EPx.
"I think you are being overly harsh..."
Hi Pot, meet Mr. Kettle:
"Hey, you're black!!"
(EP, at least I self-declare! :)
-------------------------------------
Hi Shane,
For everyone's sensibilities, please do not say harsh things, such as using the term, that "Despicable Lying Rat Bastard Wedge".
From now on, you should only use 4 out of 5 of those (" ") words in any one sentence.
I suggest you leave out "Wedge", as we will all know whom the other four refer to.
---------------------------------
Hi Flyger-
Tsk, tsk,
We all make mistakes.
"Liar" is a little...harsh !!
.)
---------------------------------
Hi Ken-
You're right. Loose talk like Flyger's could put Eclipse out of business.
Shadow,
I humbly surrender any claim of "zinger of the day", to you for your succinct and eloquent post earlier today:
"I plead none of the above. And while I'm at it on this subject, thanks for trying to marginalize the very knowledgeable people that post here. Don't take this to mean that I consider you in the group of knowledgeable people".
(Regardless whom it is directed at, it stands as one of THE all time classy posts).
Ken Meyer said...
Anyhow, obviously I pegged you right, otherwise you wouldn't react so vigorously.
Is this how you "establish facts"? I guess personal (and erroneous) attacks are all you have left. Pathetic.
This post clearly told me that your are a child in an adult's body. Grow up.
Hi Baron,
Thanks for posting the link to Cirrus and their "Perspective" avionics suite.
Yikes! If they're doing that on a piston single, think what their jet will be like!
(btw, it seems like I remember reading Avio-NG would support synthetic vision, with IS&S components ??)
Cirrus Garmin Perspective suite
Anyhow, obviously I pegged you right, otherwise you wouldn't react so vigorously.
From The Life of Brian as that was the first thing I thought of after reading your reply to Flyger:
Brian: I'm not the Messiah! Will you please listen? I am not the Messiah, do you understand?! Honestly!
Girl: Only the true Messiah denies His divinity.
Brian: What?! Well, what sort of chance does that give me? All right! I am the Messiah!
Followers: He is! He is the Messiah!
Flyger,
If you keep talking like that, your membership in the EA500 supporters club will be rescinded.
And please don't mention children. It seems EPx has a disquieting interest in young boys.
Dave,
You're kicked out of the EA500 admirer's club too.
That only leaves Ken, EPx, me (and Baron on provisional status).
You must buy a Big Gulp (!!) Koolaid mug from the Eclipse company store and submit proof of purchase to be re-admitted.
(I think many depositors are also submitting proof of purchase- but I'm not sure if they will get a mug, or anything else. Except maybe a mugging).
---------------------------------
But to make everyone feel better, I suggest a group mug, er hug. (I think wedge did the former. I don't think they felt better afterwards though).
Beedriver
If you’re into “lasers” and “optics”, and related precision equipment design/manufacturing/fabrication/tooling/testing, I’d be glad to share a method of design and machining, that has been of great help to certain high-tech companies . . . even an aircraft jet engine manufacturer. You might find it extremely helpful . . . and I am not selling it . . . I am sharing it with anyone who wishes to learn the system. It’s not free . . . it costs me “time” . . . and it will cost you the time to learn it. But I’m not charging for the knowledge.
This offer is to anyone reading this blog . . . it’s not for sale, but “free” (zero dollars) to those that will put in the time to learn it, and use it.
It would have been of great help to Eclipse in manufacturing, but early on, it was obvious that they had all the answers and would not have been interested. From Sandia, to Honeywell, to GE, to Laser measurement technology, precision aircraft accessories for high-altitude metrology, and some medical companies . . . and others, the system continues to work.
There it is!
Go through the proper channels . . . “Shane” . . . and it’s all up to you.
gadfly
(We’ve been in business for thirty-three years, and the “method” being offered has been the basis of at least 2/3rds of our design and manufacturing. ‘Not too shabby!)
I will go on the record that I am somewhere between 9Z and CWMOR on EACs survival. It is even physically stressful for me, lol, but I don't have the medical coverage for Xanex since I lost my EAC job with the August bunch. Hope springs eternal that I could return...
I am slightly more optimistic today because one of my sources recently told me that - as a condition of the BK - the new company has to compensate the City of Albuquerque for back rent in order to have continued use of the facilities. Why would Roel do that - lie - if he was really planning to leave town? There is no reason, at least no logical reason that I can think of, to do a 'pretend' Ch11/363 when you could go directly to Ch7. Roel could have just as easily bought all the IP in a Ch7 liquidation and then traveled his merry way elsewhere to build the plane. Ch7 wouldn't have required the $20 million DIP either, yes?
Secondly, IIRC, the terms of the deal is for $28 million cash, $160 in new loans via ETIRC, and 15% equity in the new company for secured creditors. So the new loans are in EjAIs or ETIRCs name, right? Why go thru all that trouble for nothing? I don't know enough about corporate credit to know how these things are tracked **after** a Ch11 is done... But at some level, the EjAI or ETIRC credit/Dunn and Bradstreet report will have to reflect the new company, and Roel Pieper, yes??? Even for private companies, the DnB web site has a listing for EAC (one mean AR lady at one of my vendors was really mad that EAC took 2-3 months to pay them the last time, before I was there, and she insisted on doing a new DnB check on EAC first before she'd send a tech out to me).
Third, Roel must have something up his sleeve regarding $$$ AFTER the sale. This has bugged me for a few days because its costing him $188 million to buy the company, but then what? He's GOT to have a lot more than just a letter of intent from VEB, cuz a guy as 'smart' as he is wouldn't go thru with something like this if he knew ahead of time that his reputation would be soiled in the end. Like the embarrassment now with not having the cash to close the deal, I really find it hard to see this as intentional. In order to start this chain of events, he must have had a ROCK SOLID feel that he'd have access to $$$ now to complete the deal and later when he'd have 100% control over the company. Because otherwise, on day one for EjAI, he'd have zero $$$ in the bank for ongoing operations. As CWMOR said, it will likely cost Roel another $500 million, and I have a funny feeling that he might have a lock on that cash. I can't believe that the Russians would be willing to pony up the $$$, so there might be another angel investor to replace Al Mann, or, maybe the Russians really want to buy EAC. I know that requires significant suspension of disbelief, BUT still consider that Roel/ETIRC might be serving as just an intermediary for the Russians since, it would be a mess for them to buy US assets directly.
Yes yes, I know this is all speculation. But there has to be some kind of end game in his head, perhaps as something as nuts as putting together an IPO for EjAI in 2-3 years! Roel has a lot of work to do to repair the Eclipse brand and there is a small chance he could do a better job (than Vern) at executing a disciplined biz plan over the next 3 years.
Yeah, today I'm more hopeful. However, the weather in NM, and my bipolar mood swings, could change 5 minutes from now...
;-)
e.d.t.
Thought I'd share this...
According to Businessweek, below are the unemplopyment stats for New Mexico:
Unemployment rate: 4.9%
Weekly benefit maximum: $355-$455
Average weekly benefit: $280.73
Benefits recipient rate: 37%
Looks like their unemployment rate is substantially below average (unless they are way behind in reporting) and have higher than average unemployment benefits.
Also from business week...
"One reason may be the two-decade-old WARN Act has rarely been enforced. WARN also exempts companies that are hit with "unforeseeable circumstances." And the perils of running afoul of the act have not been significant, since employers aren't hit with penalties—only 60 days in back pay, benefits, and possibly lawyers' fees. Even WARN class actions typically have settled for far less than cases involving gender and discrimination claims. Last July one suit filed by 930 displaced workers at Quaker Fabric was settled for $1 million. "
EDT
188M$ ...?
188 Millions $ ...?
sorry to tell you this : 28 M$ + 160 M$ of Notes
(checks on exotic wood,deed on toilet-paper,Alcoholic and Junkie promise : if my glass re-fill itself by enchantment , tomorrow i'll stop! all those "expressions" meaning the same ...)
work it out a bit :
160M$ = future "something" , do you go to a shop say to owner
"i take your stuff today and pay you with this "something" that you can cash-in in that many years IF nothing happen to me ..."
the million $ question : if you would be the owner : would you accept ?
so it leaves "only" 28 to find in reality ...
28M$ that doesn't seems to be "findable" for RP and the Board ...
even if the Russian state of Economy is not anymore what it used to be 1 year ago ...
DO you really believe that IF the Russians would be interested in this "thing" they couldn't come to the conclusion that they can put 28M$ on the table to secure all ownership of rights+patents (if any ...) then delay the building of the plant ...until the downturn is over ????
IF there is any chance that one day anyone will make a single $ of profit on this "thing" , would they drop it ?
to me it sounds like :
"I need a bus-ticket now , so if you lend me one , i will give you my car when we will arrive to my home !" ;-)
as usual = all is fluffy-stuff ...!
nothing really real , only looking like real ...
if you take such an angle to see the whole plot ...
When was RP in full knowledge of the state of EAC ? A: years ago ...!
did he knows about "cooked order-book"? A: YES , he participated himself by touting Air-Taxi in E.U. , where he cannot do it , both because of regulations AND finances (and on the side because there is no such "big" demand )...
Did he show any idea of what can be "Making sens" ? A: NO ! only playing on appearances ... ! what is important is not what it is , but what you can be pushed to deduce ...!!
like any good old scam !
i forgot :
in the 80's , Soviet-Union had wheat-production problems ...
i think it was R.Reagan that forbade US Wheat-Trade to S.U. because "it's a communist country" ... because of Afghanistan ... (curiously the situation is the same now but on opposite sides ...) bla ...bla.. bla...
everyone knowing just a little that period , can learn that US Wheat was eaten on daily basis by Soviet belly's ...
a "US Agency" having a name in 3 letters was selling the Wheat to a firm in Belgium , the firm in Belgium was , then , selling it to Soviet-Union ...
you see , if the Russians want to buy something , they do not have too many problems about it ...
this is called "Capitalism"
In S.U. , there was a joke about this :
do you know the difference between a communist hanged man and a capitalist hanged man ?
A: the communist was hanged because of his deviance to Gosplan ...
the capitalist was hanged because he sold the rope for the first guy !! ;-)
EclipsePilotOMSIV said...
I know plenty of pilots who thought a great deal of this company and plane. What made Stan more right than them?
While the pilots get the warm fuzzy feeling of security from flights completed without mishap, the critics, starting with Stan, look at the organisational instablity, the intevention in the certification process, the revolving door of suppliers, the management attitudes etc, and know from our experience you can not build 260 twins jets in this environment without some unsafe conditions.
5 AD's and the Midway accident support our argument.
Another succesful, uneventful flight increases the complacency of the Pilot, while increasing the statistical likelyhood of one of the unknown unsafe conditions killing one.
Time will tell.
Comparision of the future support of the EA-500 with the MU-2 case:
MU-2.........................EA-500
Avionics
OTS...................Boutique (x2)
Electrics
OTS CB's.................Integrated
Engines
Widely installed.......Unique model
Engine control interface
Push rods.......Uniquely Integrated
COM's/Navs'
OTS Plenty of space......Integrated
Airframe
Conventional............Partial FSW
Status at time of orphaning
Complete.................Incomplete
Grasping at such straws just prolongs the agony.
CWMR wrote With the exception of the Starship and the growing number of Piaggio P180's, it seems that in the smaller GA category critical mass is closer to 1000 units in the field, AND that was with TSO'd equipment, not proprietary avionics.
I'm sure I'm not the only one here happy that our Mackrel has his sanity back :)
Welcome back ColdWetMR.
FJT,
I would say, it's good to have CWMOR back to his normal self, but going beyond that, ah, I'd say it's good to have CWMOR back to normal self :)
(And note that that puts him back in a comfortable norm for the rest of our merry band- critic, skeptic, or advocate alike .)
I would be more charitable and gregarious except for his unkind and hurtful remark regarding 1000 being the "sustainable" minimum for GA support.
I can still buy ERcoupe fuel tank cork floats quite easily, thank you very much.
(Although I'm not sure if the corks are TSO'd or proprietary- anyone heard of the "Ernest and Julio" group? .)
---------------------------------
Fred,
I feel all blush, er, flush, with pride, becoming aware of fine european equipment that graces my ready stead. (And braces the operator, from time to time).
Ernest and Julio
EPx,
I'm glad you left the little boys out this time.
:)
"Annoy"
"Annoyance"
"Disturb"
"Disturbance"
Perturbation
Sorry EPx, there's no M in that word.
This is just too easy.
:)
billy , the shop your link is about is the kind of shop for British when they go to france for buying wines , alcohol and cigarettes ...
the second reason
i can tell you ...because this bottle is at least 2 times too expansive ... and why buy Gallo , since you can buy Rosé wine for cheaper than water ... (there is even Petrol-station , but with no gas , wines instead ...;-) you go there to fill-up your tank once a week )
and by the way EPx, you comments seemed a little...harsh !
:0
OMSIV :
what a nice way to express yourself !!;-)
BEG, the 'Coupe is a great little plane but I belive they still sigtnificantly outnumber the preemie jet, maybe what 2 or 3 to one?
Of course, I was speaking about technically advanced aircraft which require some significant support.
You can still get parts for Monocoupes and Luscombe's and such as well - but they are not supported in the same fashion someone who dropped between say $900K and 2.2M for a twinjet SHOULD expect.
I never left 'normal' BTW, normal left me ;^)
I just appreciate the challenge of looking for opportunity in this disaster and besides, how delicious would the irony be if one of the named honor roll was involved in fixing this mess?
How much better if we critics succeeded where the WCSYC group failed?
As I've said before, the key word is;
"EXPERIMENTAL"
If the prospective owner moves to wherever the factory is going to be and participates in 51% construction rule.....
He jus' MAY own his completed "EXPERIMENTAL" jet for under 1 million with the labor savings!
Jus' think:
Tonka Jet Company could even rent out dormitory space at a profit with a cafeteria. The factory has ALL the tools and tooling on hand to build the jet! Most owners have been waiting for YEARS to get their jet. Why not jus' take the time off and build it! Hmmmmmmm....saving 1.5 million for working on your own jet for lets say 2 years full time? I wonder how many individuals have ACTUALLY made that income personally in two years? Then there is the savings of money relating to the liability issue of production vs. kit.
Just imagine all the possibilities; ejection seat installation, manual JATO ignition assist if the FMS fails during take off, optional steam gauge installation, a shelf to integrate your PC in the panel if your FMS fails, and the coolest part of all.......
A smoke system so you look real cool when taking off or doing low flybys
(Of course that all depends on the cost of the actual airframe and all parts)
The additional beauty of all this is ...PARTS...they'll still be available!
Ken,
Wouldn't you like to have a smoke system to skywrite with at 37K?
;)
Sorry Guys,
I was having a personal "Wedge" moment....
Flyboy is onto something with the amateur built rules. I am sure there are still enough lines of code which still need writing to fulfill the 51% rule :)
Then again wedge invested a couple of billion $ plus the time of a few hundred non- experienced aviation professionals, for 10 ten years, so you might need to invest about a thousand man years to prove you made half of one EA500.
flyboy :
Tonka Jet Company could even rent out dormitory space at a profit with a cafeteria.
that's a good point on the size of EAC plant ...
not meant to build Aft , but to rent dormitories to customers waiting on their bird ( long , very long time accommodation !)
but be careful in your choice of words "Profits" = a very rare mantra some are supposed to say over and over for the last few years ... (some say Brother Kenny of the Flyantology ...)
saving 1.5 million for working on your own jet for lets say 2 years full time?
how can you save 1.5M$ on something NOT costing 1M$ ???
someone tells me that since the time it is out ... the price has been a "bit" inflated ...
I wonder how many individuals have ACTUALLY made that income personally in two years?
put it the other way :
if you do not make this kind of income = how do you want to keep it flying ?
there is the savings of money relating to the liability issue of production vs. kit.
the quality would have been the same , but who could bear the blame ???
Fred,
That's true...
Like I said, I was jus' having a "wedge-a-nomics" moment.(...you know, kinda like "sledge-o-matic"?)
;)
And for those that don't get it:
Wedge; the tool that does everything to destruction...
"We’ll continue the hear how little fuel the Eclipse burns"
It will only get better. When an acft goes permanently AOG, fuel consumption drops to zero. Ken should be thrilled!
whytech :
you've got a point here !
i wonder how long is going to be necessary for implementing windshield-whippers INSIDE the cockpit ...
for when the "how low consumption" will be forced to sit in , and make jet-engines noises with their mouth ...
any guesses ? 1 year ? 2 years ? no , not 3 years ... i hope ! ;-)
Awwww Fred!
You stole my idea for a play ground.....
;)
So Ken,
Whatya' think? Wouldn't it be cool to do those one wing up, low photo passes with a smoke system or skywrite?
;)
Fred:
$28m is the cash that they payout. AFAIK, they have committed to providing additional capital to fund restart + ops. I think they need a total of $150m, don't they?
And the $160m in debt is backed, I believe, by $100m and the assets of Eclipse/Eclipski.
I break it down as follows: $205m "loan guarantee" from VEB, $125m to be drawn upon immediately for Intellectual Property payment. This is probably recycled back to ETRIC and the Spanish entity. *Somebody* puts up $25m more ("equity"). Then there is $80m left in loan guarantees to build the Russian factory.
Since the $205m VEB loan guaranty deal was arranged in September '08. The difference between Sep'08 and Feb'09: $25m of "new money" and a reduction of debt from $1.1b to $160m. Oh, and ETRIC/Russians go from xx% (<<$50%, I'd guess) to 85% ownership.
This is just my read from the limited info I've seen on the blog. If this analysis is wrong, please explain.
As I understand it, ETRIC is Eclipse's largest shareholder but I've never seen them described as a majority shareholder.
Ken -
Even if flyger is realy Mike ...
Why do you care?
Why are you so bent on outing folks?
Is this your anger showing?
If you are so bent on honesty, maybe you should out your wife for asserting (per the court documents) that she was a lawyer?
Was it so the Clerk of Court would allow you to dial into the proceedings?
Is she a lawyer, or did she just stay at a Holiday Inn Express?
JR -
Per the court paperwork, ETIRC amassed roughly a 68% stake in Eclipse. Al Mann was next in line with somewhere near 15%.
Also, as discussed on the previous thread, ETIRC aka EAI aka ETARUS was to pay $28M cash, seed EAI roughly $22M cash, and offer up just under $160M in notes.
With all of the fees and escrows they needed between $60-70M in cash to close the sale.
Can anyone explain the ETRIC-Eclipse deal? As I understand it, ETRIC was involved with Eclipse going back to 2002/2003. But ETRIC was supposed to have invested $100m into Eclipse in 2008??
Interesting that the Sep'08 VEB deal was for $125m in Patent payments. This is close enough to the $100m "investment" as to raise some suspicions (totally unfounded, of course, given the ethical practices of those involveed with Eclipse). Was ETRIC trying to finance their investment with VEB money? Was the $100m "investment" supposed to close after ETRIC did the VEB deal? Thus, was the "investment" bought but not paid for? Did Eclipse effectively made a (noncash) loan (or maybe stock swap) to ETRIC - essentially providing purchaser financing - to be paid when the VEB deal closes?
ETRIC got stock because they were going to build out the European market - key to which was the Russian factory/investment. That never happened. RP was made CEO because ETRIC was largest shareholder and Russian investment seemed to the the "answer" to the Eclipse woes. But the Russian $$ has still not come, and instead RP (as CEO) takes Eclipse into BK.
Just wondering: Could ETRIC's investment be voided, clearing the way for a *real* Ch11 sale? (where ETRIC/RP doesn't vet/push out other offers) My guess is that even if it were technically possible, we're too far along in the process and so much Eclipse value has been lost already that Ch7 is more likely than revisiting Ch11 issues.
Gentlemen (and ladies),
Some of the language is getting a little strident.
I know emotions are higher for the past few days, but please lets all avoid remarks which would tend to denigrate each other.
In particular, 'flyger' has made certain remarks about Ken, and EclipsePilotOMSIV has overstepped the 'anglo saxon' line a few times.
Post's will now be deleted, without reference, if the blog minders deem such action appropriate.
As an aside, I should inform everyone that there is more than one person doing the deletion of offending posts. They will simply 'vanish' and not be seen again. I've had to do it a few times over the past year and have no hesitation in doing it again, if required.
Shane
JR -
Per RP's statements (lies) on the record, ETIRC had a business deal with EAC dating back to December 2007.
That deal included direct investments, and a multi-level licensing option.
ETIRC paid their direct investment commitments, which is what gave them the ~68% stake and the power to oust the Wedge.
ETIRC did not execute their licensing option.
We can assume that ETIRC planned to use the VEB money to fund their licensing options, but despite the prevailing assumptions (albeit fuelled by both EAC and ETIRC), there was no evident obligation to send the VEB money to ABQ.
Now … instead of funding their licensing options ETIRC apparently wants to use the AirLyper money to buy EAC in bankruptcy, and the VEB money to fund ongoing operations.
If ETIRC does use the VEB money to fund ABQ operations, somewhere he needs to find another Ponzi-sucker to make good on the Russian factory.
Per the limited documents available through the Court website, to say that ETIRC is using “EAC money to buy EAC” appears to be a convenient exageration, but there are clearly only a few pools of money that RP has ever had available.
jack :
as you said ...
my understanding of the situation is :
the VEB is providing a loan (but with their latest call for urgent help , i wonder if they have anything spare for such an entertaining and wasteful saga ...)
as far as i know , NONE of this money is to provide for any Rights ...
call the Russians whatever you want , but they aren't silly enough to pay for something that could be picked-up for near nothing in Chap.7...
not putting emphasis on the fact for the Russians having a plant build on their own soil is one thing ...
having a bunch of guys playing with that money is a completely different matter !
that is the reason why IF loan then No one out of russian officials in charge of the money ... (the reason why VEB would pledge the loan from etrick to itself , VEB would enter the capital as a controlling entity ...!)
i understand very well your calculation ...
BUT
up to now , this saga has been made almost exclusively of broken promises , lies , BS , smoke & mirrors ...
so in consequence , what we can calculate with some "nearly exactitude" is what ALREADY exist ...
the 100M$ you mention are part of the money from VEB , so it is better to void it ...
the assets are of non-meaningful interests , if they would be , more bidders would have been in the game ...
so what can we see here ?
A: an empty shell (Etrick) having interests in a bankrupt firm ... to make a product that didn't sell when Economy was booming (when was the last REAL order for a fpj ; REAL not ones of the ones touted by RP [300 /1000 ] for European Air-taxi market ...with NO VALID EASA , HOW is that POSSIBLE ? and with what money ? IF etrick would have ordered such an amount of FPJ and PAY FOR it , EAC wouldn't have problems now ...!)
an empty shell asking a third country to grant a loan , to take out some money , to pay for some "intellectual rights" (funnily i thought EAC was the owner of those rights ...therefor EAC should have had the money , therefor voiding the BK process ... )
"intellectual rights" that we see coming back to the very same firm that asked the loan ???
i don't know about you , but to me it is very smelly already !!
i still don't know about you , but there is a much simpler way to explain all this mess :
VEB was supposed to loan (but having approval (or LOI ) is very different than having money ready ...
the "Intellectual rights" was supposed to be paid for by a chunk of the loan ...
off course Etrick was at the same time the one asking for the loan , paying the "rights" and getting this money ... (this is where the mock-up Spanish bird came in for ...)
repeating in this what Etrick has already done in EAC/ABQ when being at the same time : the conductor , the orchestra , the TV shooting the play and the public applauding it... all at the same time ...
conclusion =
everything is related to the very same money (the loan from VEB)
it is only passed from one firm to an other firm for fictitious needs and payments ...
all the Numbers are purely "made-up" as they are backed by strictly nothing ...
except a promise (soon to be broken...)
the 28M$ was supposed to come one way or an other from the Loan ...
problem : RP hasn't got the cash to compensate those 28M$ , mainly because the Russian Loan HAS NEVER BEEN MEANT for anything else than Building the factory ...
Under such lending terms , no money was supposed to be "at disposal" for RP needs ...
if any sum would have been , the Russians would have only get pregnant in the back !! ;-)
ask yourself a simple question :
if VEB pay for the factory ...
if VEB pay for running factory ...
if VEB pay for "rights"
if VEB pay for buying the 363 ...
but DOESN'T KEEP control of the project ...
i would suggest this : WHY do they NEED RP for ?
He is not a aviation pro
he is not a pro of business (many failures ...)
he is not Russian
he may not even be rich ...
why do they need him for ?
final conclusion : too many tricks , too many unknown , too many greedy around ...
the Russian Do NOT want to waste any money at a time it is really needed ...
the Money doesn't arrive ...
RP is gone missing ...
Mann left the boat smelling "the burnt pot"
the 363 plot collapse under its own weight !
Hey Shane you should also tell your boy Bill to cease and desist regarding the little boy comments with respect to me. I find it EXTREMELY offensive.
I'm just very surprised that ETRIC fully paid, in cash, for a *68%* stake in an American company whose sales were, up to that point, all to non-europeans and that was capitalized at hundreds of millions of dollars.
I thought ETRIC was just part of the "high volume production" story, like the Airtaxi BS. Weirdness abounds in the Eclipse saga.
Zed: I didn't realize that the ETRIC-Eclipse deal had 2 parts: investment and licensing. Thanks for the info.
Fred: I think the VEB deal was negotiated for a long time. Probably starting about the same time as the ETRIC-Eclipse agreement (that Zed says was in December 2007).
During the negotiations, and when oil was going higher and higher, an investment in ETRIC/Eclipse may have seemed to make some sense. As you say, it makes no sense now (providing financing to a shell co.buying a bankrupt luxury goods co. in depression, LOL)
jackrabit -
I too was amazed that RP got that much of the company for such a small investment.
Goes to show how desparate the company was for cash during the autumn and winter of 2007-2008.
The note holders and other investors watched their investment share dilute to virtually nothing overnight.
We can assume that ETIRC planned to use the VEB money to fund their licensing options, but despite the prevailing assumptions (albeit fuelled by both EAC and ETIRC), there was no evident obligation to send the VEB money to ABQ.
Actually that is in the court filings by the Bradley group. ETIRC was supposed to pay around $200K per unit as a license fee to Eclipse. Eclipse made much of this pre-BK and now Roel is trying to not only not pay his debt to Eclipse but use the money he owes Eclipse to buy Eclipse. Roel is falsing claiming that he wasn't able to find the money and is instead diverting it for his own uses.
$200K per unit? That is likely near the margin Cessna sees on the Mustang.
These guys have NEVER been operating in the same universe, let alone on the same planet as the rest of us.
That is pure insanity.
Its just strange. If ETRIC owned a controlling stake in the company, why would they need to purchase/license the patents?
Also, why would Russia, even in good times, finance the purchase of the patents?
Lastly, from a business logic point of view any licensing payments would probably only be made after EASA, right? EASA was accomplished on Nov 21 -- BK followed on the 25th!
Doesn't it all make more sense that ETRIC "paid" for the stock with a note (or some portion). That the VEB was being played, in that the immediate drawdown on the loan guaranty of $125m was to pay for the Eclipse investment/stock purchase ($100m, as advertised) and license payment ($25m?? - or maybe the just keep the $25m for operating expenses) And that the Note and licensing payment would come due within x days/weeks/months after EASA?
What happens if BK occurs BEFORE the Note is due and payable. Does it show up as one of many "other" assets instead of as a *receivable* asset (so no one seeks to collect it)?
Of course this is just speculation. Its just weird that ETRIC owns 68%??!!!?!?!?
Its just strange. If ETRIC owned a controlling stake in the company, why would they need to purchase/license the patents?
First off I think it was crazy to pay around $200K per unit, but as to why they would do it, keep in mind that Vern was running things then and Vern's interests as CEO were vastly different than Roel's interest now. Along those same lines keep in mind that Vern was fired as a condition of new financing that never showed up.
It would not suprise me at all if Roel is using the same VEB financing twice - the first time being to fire Vern and get a larger stake and the second time to buyout Eclipse (or maybe even three times if that was to be fees paid to Eclipse because ETIRC is a distributor).
One good thing with the economy the way it is is that there's a better chance of such transactions being investigated as Roel has been financially prevented from ramming through the Eclipse sale.
I had forgotten about Vern being fired as the terms of Eclipse receiving additional financing and it wasn't until now that my memory was refreshed.
JR, nothing should be surprising or wierd in this passion play.
ETIRC got the deal of a lifetime with their cramdown - but even then myself and others asked 'why'?
Not why EAC agreed to the cramdown, that was obvious - but why ETIRC invested any real money.
It is now beginning to look like ETIRC maybe did not provide any real money, but rather there was an exchange of 'commitments', a little bit of cash, and the spinning of the Eclipski plant.
The entire story defies logic given the facts known and suspected from the public sphere (admitting there are certainly 'secret' facts known to Vern and RiP and others that we have zero insight into), and has made no sense since about 2006, maybe even earlier.
There is still talk about air taxi operations in the context of VLJ's - but the Mustang and the Phenom 100 ought to provide yeoman's service there comparted to the abysmal experience of DayJet, Linear Air and others.
As Fred has pointed out, without Jar-Ops 1 approval, the EA-500 cannot be used in commercial service in EU nations - and even if they had JAR-OPS 1 in hand, they would be competing against Europe's excellent network of high-speed rail and other public transportation.
The business case for the EA-500 has always been 'optimistic' at best - but the proof is now in the pudding. After $3B and a decade, there ARE 260 effectively orphaned jets out there right now, that are probably going hard AOG every few days.
The Tiger I mentioned earlier was in sproadic production over a decade after its' resurrection, 181 planes were produced by 2 entities - both dead now. Luscombe was restarted twice. There was Micco, Taylorcraft, etc.
Airplanes of any kind cannot be bootstrapped but even in the face of unprecedented funding like Eclipse enjoyed, the key is the need for good management, strong requirements definition and management, and steady focus on execution of the plan. Moving targets and executive fancy are fatal, regardless of the m,oney available - we have learned this lesson many times over the past several decades.
The postmortem on this will be a case study in how not to run a business, and how ever changing requirements will kill even an unlimited budget.
It wouldn't have to be a note. Could be some other "arrangement" (stock swap and repurchase agreement, etc.).
But if there was to be some sort of payment, triggered to EASA (the point at which ETRIC's Eclipse rights would start to have some real value) then controlling the BK process (and ensuring that no other bidders are serious enough to have a detailed look) *could*be a way to delay/defray/obviate/etc. the need for that payment. Instead of making the payment, use the $$ to buy Eclipse (as Bradley group suspects).
Who knows?? Maybe the Bradley group will get at the truth. Maybe the truth is that there is no reason for concern. It just seems so strange that ETRIC owns 68%!
Zed: Was Eclipse's finances so bad at end of 2007 that they would do such a deal? And how was ETRIC able to raise the money? Why didn't Eclipse turn to private equity (because Wedge would be forced out?)
Dave wrote ... Eclipse made much of this pre-BK and now Roel is trying to not only not pay his debt to Eclipse but use the money he owes Eclipse to buy Eclipse. Roel is falsing claiming that he wasn't able to find the money and is instead diverting it for his own uses.
We are reading most of the same docs, but I don't see any hard and fast obligation to pay EAC licensing money. It was an option to execute at ETIRCs discression.
Possibly as Jackrabbit proposed is that the options were fluff to sweeten the deal, and RP never intended to execute them.
Whether he uses the VEB money for EAC or his yacht is between he and the VEB ... and, OK ... maybe the VEB's goon squad enforcers.
CWMOR wrote ... It is now beginning to look like ETIRC maybe did not provide any real money, but rather there was an exchange of 'commitments', a little bit of cash, and the spinning of the Eclipski plant.
I thought that Shane found the two cash deposits Jan/Feb '08 and May/Jun '08 in the records.
I think that there was some insufficient amount of cash and the promise of VEB money that got Wedge and the EAC BoD's attention.
Remember that Wedge was offered the role as Vice Chairman of ETIRC to market the FPJ in Europe ... and then bailed on that after a week or two.
Maybe he saw something, or just didn't want to tell RP to cram it until he had his loaner FPJ out of Dodge.
Zed: It's ETRIC's 68% stake and VEB's $125m for Patent rights that has me scratching my head. There may have been some (small?) payments but it seems to me that if ETRIC would not be able to get so much Equity without bringing in a big fish. That fish would seem to be related to VEB's $125m.
With that in mind, I think: what would be the mechanics of the transaction. This leads me to some trigger based on EASA. I know that company was hurting leading up to EASA, but EASA was needed to secure the VEB financing and seems likely as a trigger for whatever cash transactions were contemplated by the ETRIC-Eclipse "investment agreement" (for lack of a better term).
JackRabbit wrote ... Was Eclipse's finances so bad at end of 2007 that they would do such a deal? And how was ETRIC able to raise the money? Why didn't Eclipse turn to private equity (because Wedge would be forced out?)
Were their finances so bad?
- Probably
Why not turn to private equity?
- ETIRC was the $140M PE promise.
- Empire building. Options on 500 or 1000 jet sales in Europe. RP was playing Wedge's fiddle with that.
- Then the Russian factory deal doesn't get signed in Spring '08, then slips again to Autumn '08, then Winter '09 ... and we are still waiting.
As Chairman of EAC, RP was unable to close the Russian factory deal for 9 months now ... the deal that would have enabled EAC (his company) to continue operating ... and yet the lemmings think RP will close the deal in the next 48hours?
Folly! The VEB deal didn't work in May '08 and it certainly doesn't work in Feb '09.
Finally, our friend Ken claims that ETIRC has 260-300 orders in Europe. Yes, they are ETIRC planes ... so essentialy RP deposited $140M for ~260 delivery positions.
The company said Pieper's leadership is part of an agreement that brings with it a new round of financing that will give the company a positive cash flow. The amount of the cash infusion was not disclosed.
Eclipse Aviation founder, CEO resigns
So where is that money that was continually delayed that was part of Roel taking over as CEO?
If Roel is playing games with the Russians, he'd better hope that they don't slip polonium in his tea or that some stranger stranger doesn't stab him with a ricin-tipped umbrella.
RP didn't have the kind of BIG investment $$$ that a 68% stake would imply (as far as I can see). So it all seems to lead back to VEB's $125m.
Prudent business practice is to pay for performance. A strategic partnership is fine but why GIVE RP 68% unless it involves some kind of Note or stock swap (or combination) that is somehow tied to: 1) VEB's investment (maybe not explicitly in the ETRIC-Eclipse Agreement, but that is where the $$ comes from ultimately); and 2) EASA.
Shane found 2 (small) payments about 3 months apart: how much were they? Were they for the same amount (or nearly so?) Could they be quarterly interest payments (on a Note/Convertible Note)?
An upbeat "European story" (Russian factory, EASA, ETRIC licensing payments, etc.) would have made it easier for Eclipse to raise money. Maybe it was envisioned that the stock swap would be unwound at some point (maybe Eclipse had an option to repurchase its stock from ETRIC)??
Dave,
That bit about a "new round of financing" as the reason for "firing" Vern was always played fast and loose. When he announced his own termination Vern himself said something along the lines of his resignation being called for as a condition of the new financing.
The company also put out a press release that said the Eclipse was engaged in transaction to bring in financing, and I think it said they had received "initial funds".
But the company, nor Vern, nor RP ever said anything more about from whom or how much such a financing would be, so it became obvious pretty quickly that there was no financing transaction anywhere near ready to close.
Which leaves the question of Vern's termination. My guess is that RP told Vern he would have to go if he (RP) was going to lift a finger to help get financing for EAC. They negotiated, Vern got an aircraft and severance, and then resigned. RP may have waved some financing LOI type stuff to prove to Vern that he could bring in the money, but not unless Vern resigned.
But the company, nor Vern, nor RP ever said anything more about from whom or how much such a financing would be, so it became obvious pretty quickly that there was no financing transaction anywhere near ready to close.
That goes to JR's point. Roel himself touted the new round of financing as being not only enough for Eclipse to get to breakeven but for Eclipse to reach profitability. After Eclipse being vague then they got specific on Russian money being their savior. It just seems like Roel got the 68% stake based on the Russian money and is using that same Russian money to get a 100% stake.
Jack
don't forget that RP got control over EAC because he brought a Bank-Guarantee ...
so basically and without knowing the "quality" of this said guarantee , i would point out that he bought EAC for nothing but paper ...!
i am not sure of the "quality" of the said guarantee because IF Etrick GOT CONTROL over EAC , it was for a supposed FAILED PAYMENT EAC owed to etirc ...
here , it is really very important to remember that etric was supposed to be a minor partner buying lots of Fpj and taking part in the commercialization of the Fpj ABROAD ...
so it would be natural to expect a Cash movement from Etirc TO EAC ...
but curiously ( this is very weak word)
Etirck took control of EAC because of a failed payment so a Cash movement FROM EAC to Etirc
the least anyone can say : it is very curious !
like if you would go to see your preferred car dealer , as k to buy 1000 of your favorite car , and the dealer would have to PAY YOU ???
i wouldn't be surprised for a Kopeck that the whole plot has been constructed in very early time ...
involving some official(s) from Ulyanovsk (part of scam or not)
which would be a very good explanation of the why at beginning , Etric had no problems getting all letters of intend , approval and the like from VEB ...
because it was on the local level ... (VEB being a dev. bank it is more or less independent into the regions , independent except about big $)
but when it was time to release the cash , Upper-level had to be informed ...
and they didn't see the plot with the same eyes ...
the whole scam between Wedge and RP was precisely made on a question of timing ...
the BK date , cert. and all deeds seems to confirm it ...
what they couldn't expect :
the credit crunch , which voided the biggest part of the plan , but as it is a scam = no flexibility and no way out !
where a normal profitable business relation can adapt to delays ...
they couldn't expect that the situation on oil market would deteriorate that fast , therefor putting the "plot" under careful scrutinize from VEB head-branch ...
as all scam in the world :
no time to let peoples think ...
such a good opportunity , you cannot miss it ...
so many weird things happening ...
so many peoples to trick themselves with the magical sentence "you do not see the whole picture ..."
skeptic do not see the big-picture , may be because they are skeptic ... may be just because there is NOTHING to be seen !!
Dave, JR, etc.
If you read the original BK filing it tells the entire story of ETIRC invested in "this", which converted to "that", and was upgraded to "whatever".
An analysis of that document will give an idea what RP actually paid for what he now has control of.
sorry , jack ...
the beginning of post is misleading !!
if memory serve me well , the Bank guarantee was brought by RP to EAC has a long-term deal for funding enough the firm until profits (what a joke)
in exchange , RP and Etrick got a whole world out of USA right of sell , lease and maintain ...
it is only later that the same bank-guarantee became the argument for taking control over EAC ...
due to this mysterious payment ...
but the Guarantee was supposed to be against World rights ...???
so again , Wedge + RP were buying different things with exactly the same money !!!
(as far as a bank-guarantee can be taken for real money ...!)
zed ...
yes !
the problem with BK paper :
they have been worked-out to show what RP wanted to show ...
nothing else !
quite confident that a good audit on "who did what with whom" would be a case where the BK-judge would pull her hair off in surprise ...
this is the "NO-time" element of any scam ...
TBM: I have limited knowledge of that time, but my take on Vern's departure is that RP/Russian due diligence discovered something that made his continuing with the company a non-starter (bogus orders?).
Maybe the stock swap/note was triggered by VEB's LOI. Maybe it would later be unwound after EASA. Maybe ETRIC's investment in Eclipse is contractually obligated once ETRIC secures financing and EASA. We could think up dozens of what-if and scenarios, but fundamentally, 68% and $125m for patents seem tied in some way.
Do we know what ETRIC's stake was BEFORE the December 2007 agreement?
Fred: that's amazing. Vern was out because Eclipse missed a payment to ETRIC. So, so strange.
Maybe ETIRC had some sort of warrant deal that kicked in when EAC had not obtained EASA by the start of Oshkosh (the sort of deadline Vern would use).
No EASA, warrants are exercised for nominal payment, % ownership goes up from 50.1% to 68%, Vern is shown the door. This would make sense if ETIRC's original deal anticipated sales in Europe, which couldn't happen without EASA cert.
Once Vern was out of the way, RP probably planned to take it Chap. 11 for 363 sale. He had to wait to get EASA done, knowing he couldn't obtain it once BK was filed. Hence the timing. He had to put $ in during the interim to keep it going, or get Mann to put $ in.
TBM: There's something like that going on. Warrants, Notes, contingencies: all centered on VEB's money and EASA.
The notion of "progress payments" comes to mind. (Vern was already asking for such from depositors, right?). Maybe ETRIC makes payments as long as they do not "deliver" their investment (um, much like interest on a Note), and Eclipse makes payments if they don't deliver EASA. Maybe Eclipse had choice of $ or warrants. Maybe Vern chose to pay in warrants, not thinking that RP would oust him.
Yea, Vern looked pretty shell shocked when he announced his resignation.
TBM: Yes! EASA had to be done before BK. Which brings up troubling questions: Did RP/BoD delay BK to get EASA (to secure the VEB $). Did that have a material effect on the company? What if BK had been done in Jul'08? A sale in Sep'08 would have fetched MUCH MUCH more for creditors.
I guess I 'll answer my own question: they were close to the VEB LOI (they got it in Sep'08)so it probably made sense to get that, and then they were close enough to EASA that it made sense to try to get that before BK (it adds substantially to the value of the Company).
Also, Boards work on behalf of equity holders. I'm not sure what, if any, obligation they have to others (employees, suppliers, debt holders, etc.)
very simplistically,
RP was a board member when he was dealing with the Russians. He arranged some financing related to licensing EA50 and producing them in Russia. He took over EAC, threw it into 363, and is using the royalty financing arrange while running EAC, to buy the assets. As a step lalong the way, he lied to everyone about needing two factories, and then closed ABQ, (right as predicted) probably to give the ULSK facotry/Russian VEB money comfort that they would get jobs.
I see two main ptoblems:
Lying
and
Stealing (in the Corp. sense, "conversion")
It has been more than 72 hours since the last "almost funded" report.
Any insight from ABQ?
Zed said: ... so essentialy RP deposited $140M for ~260 delivery positions
Was the ETRIC-Eclipse deal for $140m? Was some of this for deposits on planes? Did ETRIC's plane positions turn into equity/warrants somehow (if no EASA?)? Maybe the ETRIC payments in Feb/Mar and May/Jun were deposit payments (from ETRIC as distributor)??
If we assume that all/most of the $125m from VEB was to be paid for ETRIC's "investment" in Eclipse, then what did ETRIC actually invest in Eclipse (did some or all of the remaining $15m might come from depositors)?
What did RP tell Vern? Probably not his financing source and that the money for the*EQUITY* investment would be borrowed.
Maybe Vern got booted because he spent precious resources on the new single engine jet instead of EASA? RP would then have told the BoD that Vern put the financing at risk.
EPx:
"Yeah, we get it. The avionics are not perfect at this point in time. Give yourself a nice pat on the back. Or better yet, go jerk off. Get yourself off like the rest of the young boys."
BUT THEN,
EPx,
"Hey Shane you should also tell your boy Bill to cease and desist regarding the little boy comments with respect to me. I find it EXTREMELY offensive."
Hey Kettle, meet Pot: "Hey, you're black."
EPx, are you impossibly arrogant or just impossibly stupid?
I'll just go with impossible for now.
Make that EXTREMELY impossible.
-----------------------------------------------
Your good posts are quite good (you're obviously intelligent and successful), but like Tuourettes Guy you can snap into the basest and vilest posts at the slightest criticism. I believe you are needlessly burdened by self doubt- I would instead recommend some self introspection.
Tourette's Guy
Introspection
Good advice for all of us, BEG and EPx included.
(And just don't buy any Colgate's toothpaste for a while :)
------------------------------------------------
(I believe you're a nice guy- and I wish you'd believe it too- despite anyone trying to convince you otherwise- including yourself- so tell that self doubt to go F itself! :-)
And get a puppy- but ALWAYS treat it nice- if you can't, then that's a barometer that something else is wrong and needs to be dealt with, for the puppies, and ever more importantly, your own happiness, which you DO FULLY deserve:
LBJ with Beagles
And EPx,
Now it's your turn to help me.
I can't figure out how to change the cork in the ERcoupe tank.
.)
(Although I'm a little afraid of what suggestions on cork placement I might receive! :)
RP was a board member when he was dealing with the Russians. He arranged some financing related to licensing EA50 and producing them in Russia. He took over EAC, threw it into 363, and is using the royalty financing arrange while running EAC, to buy the assets.
ATM,
We don't know that he ever negotiated with the Russians on direct behalf of EAC wearing his BOD hat. He may very well have negotiated with them as ETIRC, and negotiated with EAC as ETIRC. So while it may be true that he negotiated with the Russians concerning Eclipse production rights while he sat on the board of EAC, that in and of itself is not necessarily double dealing. In fact, if that's what he did and disclosed it to EAC, then he didn't do anything shady. Just crafty, like a fox, waiting to pounce on the unsuspecting Vern.
Mommy tell me a bedtime story…
Tell me again how little fuel the Eclipse uses.
Tell me about the Battle of Sandia where King Pieper vanquished Sir Raburn.
Tell me about the Cossacks of the Eastern Steppes rescuing the Natives of New Mexico.
Tell me again how the great shipment of Rubles arrived as rose petals were scattered on the dusty streets of Albuquerque.
Mommy, tell me the happy ending about the Eclipse 500 flying off into the sunset with no forecast icing.
TBMs:
I agree, except for timing.
IIRC, Roel SAID EAC had financing from the Russians for ANOTHER FACTORY in Russia, in addition to the ABQ factory.
He even made a big deal about clarifying that ABQ would remain, and that they would be back to rate production in 2009, 2010, BASED ON THE RUSSIAN FINANCING.
So...
B.E.G.
If the gas cap isn't big enough... tin snips and rivet gun.
B.T.,
Thanks for the tip!
---------------------------------
This is one of those "believe it or not" stories- and it's true;
I had a friend with a leaking gas tank, and a welder, and well, you know how the rest of the story goes.
The gas tank did not prove to be the "thermal heat sink" that he expected. The results were, ah, rather spectacular.
He survived that escapade, unscathed, thankfully, which is more than I can say about his project or the hangar.
Same guy had his leg smashed in a motorcycle accident when a station wagon pulled out in front of him- good spirits, despite 12 weeks in the hospital.
Being driven home from the hospital, on an icy road, hit a telephone pole- back in the hospital with the other leg broken.
Sad, but true. Irony is pretty...ironic.
(Less good spirits the second time, but a briefer stay- no compound fractures- out a week later).
It seems to me that among the multitude of Eclipse problems, from management to production to financing, is the fact that they now face a fair amount of competition.
It seems that a part of Vern's plan was to take a commanding lead in the marketplace. That hoped for strength will never happen.
Finally, some news...
Can this be real?
Sadly, I think we all know the answer to that.
I must also warn everyone that the 'fat lady' is tuning up, and is about to sing the final aria.
Those vital 'cogs of commerce' (a.k.a the bankers to EAC) have been squeaking for some time now, and urgently need lubrication.
Lots and LOTS of it.
News reaches me (and those aforementioned banks) of a most serious development. It would seem that the Russian VEB (their State Investment Bank, loosely translated) have yet again failed to clear the funds needed for ETRUS/ETIRC to proceed with the Chapter 11 sale.
While a final demand has not been issued by the Board of EAC to Roel, I understand that it's almost midnight on this particular clock.
At this time, please think of the hardworking, honest folks who's lives have been dislocated by this company, and be considerate with your comments.
Especially to (and about) each other.
Shane
And a hearty thank you to the 'joker' who sent me that 'cheque'.
Whoever you are....
Shane
Greetings,
For the furloughed employees of Eclipse, I have collected some information on benefits and such at http://tttpages.com/eclipse/
This is just info for employees, not of much interest to others, but I know some employees visit this site.
Thanks
Brian
Brian,
Great stuff. Thanks for reaching out to the dedicated employees through the blog.
A word of guidance on personal items possibly left within any EAC building ...
... if you have access to the building this week it is best to clear out all of your personal property before (1) the sale closes, or (2) things turn for the worse.
Once the buildings and their contents are transfered, it will be cumbersome to extract personal stuff comingled with company stuff.
Easier to do it at your convenience, but soon.
“Once the buildings and their contents are transferred, it will be cumbersome to extract personal stuff commingled with company stuff.”
Is this the example of going out with a “whimper”?
Who would have guessed!
gadfly
Some would have preferred a shout! . . . and still not one complete bird!
Some would have preferred a shout! . . . and still not one complete bird!
I expect there were many complete birds given in the direction of Eclipse by the furloughed employees.
I just ran across this post about ENAER supplying nose sections to Eclipse. To find the post you have to scroll down a bit, but if you crunch the numbers in there, they were expect to have an annual volume of selling at least 700 units per year to Eclipse. They also bought a lot of equipment that they couldn't use for their other clients. It's an interested read on the history of Eclipse.
With Eclipse costing all these companies millions of dollars based on a trumped up order book I think will set back aviation...in particular when a new start-up comes along. Nobody will want to be burned by the next Eclipse and they'll make it much more difficult for the next company to come along. There's the old saying: "Fool me once, shame on you; Fool me twice, shame on me."
oh guys (and girls ?)
i don't really buy the story of our Wedge being ousted by the fox named RP ...
mainly because :
this saga doesn't make any sens at all ...
(so many stunts , so many tricks , so many to have a multitude of cap ...!)
IF Wedge could succeed into running this mess for 10 years , with an unprecedented mass of cash , with so many "master-piece of disinformation" ...
how can someone come with the idea that he could be ousted by a guy knowing the fact that they have been dealing together for a much longer time than it would seems on first glance ...
(i am quite sure they have each other from the time they both failed in Computer business ...)
so i would see the plot unveiling more this way :
the first flight is a fiasco , they decided to take the money from depositors , this is where the whole scam started ...off-course , in order to play this way , to be dishonest (more or less = no one will ever know if they did it on the purpose to steal cash from deposits or if they genuinely thought they could make it ) had to be planned a bit in advance ...
the fate was sealed when the first Fpj landed and the engines broke apart ...
then it has been a continuous piece of art of manipulation for Staff , Medias , Depositors ...
this is where i partially exonerate our Kenny from some guilt , some peoples want to believe so much into something (to make their life worth something that no one achieved before?) that he was probably a hand-picked-choice for manipulation by being manipulated himself ...
in such , our kenny would have known his "Behavior of irrational expectations" instead of being about Billions and stocks or whatever finances scam , it was about showing his master-knowledge of what-is-flying and business know-how (multiples deposits ) in touting how excellent EAC and its product were (supposed to be) wonderful ...
missing , like so many others , the point that there absolutely ONLY one thing in which someone (if believer) can put faith and trust = Religion ... ! in ALL other matters , just know as much as you can and remain humble to understand that no one can know enough ... (if it happens that someone knows all of a subject : it is almost always too late to be of some real use !)
so Wedge run the plot ...
don't forget the Whole-plot at beginning was 3 guys ...
curiously , the third is already out , no one knows or hear things about "dayjet" anymore ...
which is something crucial in the saga as i do believe the planes dayjet got were actually being build , paid and maintained WITH depositors money ...
Wedge was the one to wear the captain's hat , no doubts about this ...
so he had to have a way out ...
the best for him was to shift from one side (ugly corrupted scamers) to the other side (victims) = the best way to release him from most kinds of guilt ...
to make him looking almost sympathetic ...
the poor gullible american being ousted by this damn foreign rat named RP ...
(Do not forget that i came into this blog when i started to read all the shit and prejudicial ideas Wedge + RP was trying to put into US minds ... like "everybody in E.U. is crawling for Fpj ..." or " in E.U. , everyone is waiting on jet-air-taxi for going from A to B in a convenient and timely manner" which is absolute shit-talk , infrastructures of transportation are excellent and not at all relying on Fpj ...)
so what was the best way for Wedge to be washed from all his sins at the wheel of EAC ?
to be ousted in a coup !
like this : bye-bye guilt , if you have any doubts , how can anyone explain Wedge keeping his own bird ?
he managed to even push scammed ones to feel some kind of sympathy for his fate ...
Bye-bye all the stunts organized to steal a little more in each ones pockets ...
bye-bye the 2 Billions already wasted for nearly nothing ...
bye_bye th Billion wasted in unpaid bills ...
so if you link together all parts of the plot :
this has been planned for a very long time , RP and Wedge are still good buddies , they are probably having good laugh together with the "dayjet" guy ...
as a complement to previous :
if RP would be the fox : Wedge and the Bod would have been damn stupid ...
how to explain that those ones have been fooled by RP ?
him being only a minor part of EAC board ...
so RP would either need to be extremely clever and cunning ...but then HOW to explain his precedent failures ? you can never teach a new trick to an old dog ...
once again it doesn't make any sens ...!
so in order to fool so much other members :
they had to be totally blind !
or
they had to be totally careless
or
they had to have a dummy inside !
so the whole plot was designed long-ago ...
and the VEB is only a way to drown fish in water !!!
only a way to wash away all liabilities (the surest road to some kind of return was to screw all others before ...)
to give back a kind of virginity to Wedge ...
and take out all kind of tangible richness out of reach form the ones who brought that "richness"
this is where the notion of "soft theft by use of cleverness" take all its meaning ...
they are not so clever ...
their cleverness :
to draw a scenario and stick to it !! ;-))
www.eclipsejetcare.com. Should be of interest to some.
Kathy ...
this is real interest for already owners ...
it state "providing" maintenance for all Fpj within the USA ...
since there isn't any bought AND delivered out of it , it should be more than enough ...
Our Kenny has a chance to keep his one , even if he has to reach more than often to the "check-book" ...!
still that would be probably the first good news in a while for ALREADY owners ...
all others should give-up hopes !!
I can't keep quiet anymore. Can someone PLEASE tell Fred to shup up. His moronic ramblings are always wrong and yet again another post that's just blatantly untrue.
Please Fed-up
do not please me in making so many compliments ... ! ;-)
shut-up ?
you must be dreaming ...
i never shut-up in front of anybody , that's part of my job !
Fed Up,
Welcome to the blog.
You'll find people will pay far more attention to your comments when you contribute something.
Until that time, might I suggest that you read what Fred IS saying. I suspect you'd be flabbergasted if you knew his background and specialist expertise.
Fred is like all of us who comment here. As individuals we are often wrong, in detail.
However, taken as a group, the blog has been 'correct'.
Or at least far better than EAC in anticipating the future.
Which is rather a pity, since the blog didn't go into Chapter 11 owing almost a Billion dollars to suppliers, various depositors and the banks.
Neither did 'we' end up sending 800 people home on a 'furlough' which increasingly looks like it'll become permanent.
So, when/if you are ready, please bring something new or relevant to the blog.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Even if you are fed up.
Shane
Fred,
It wasn't so much that RP was so crafty as to fool the BOD and wedge. It was more that Wedge was hoisted on his own pitard.
If Wedge made an investment deal with RP which included a provision about a deadline for EASA approval, then you have an explanation for all that followed. Would Wedge make such a deal? Sure. He was always underestimating how long things took to get done. If he had the belief that EASA was almost done early last year, around the time he made the deal with RP, then for him to promise it would be done by Oshkosh is not such a stretch. It would give him plenty of cushion in terms of timeframe.
RP wouldn't have to have been crafty to make such a deal. He'd just have to have been applying common sense. He's making a deal in which he will get the rights to sell FPJ in Europe, so naturally he wants some assurance that EASA will get done in a timely manner.
The BOD would have gone along with this approach given that Wedge would have been predicting EASA approval in 1st quarter of last year, rather than 4th quarter.
This is a very simple scenario. I'm surprised you reject it out of hand. Wedge's ego is way too large for him to think he'd need an exit stage left, as opposed to riding into the sunset the ultimate hero of GA.
sorry TBM ...
may be i didn't express myself well enough ...!
i agree with your conclusion , and like you , believe that Wedge's ego wouldn't fit in outer-space ...
the point i was trying to make :
if you analyze the progression of RP influence and control inside BOD , it could be somehow evident that RP has/had a shark-appetite ...
after literally cheating everybody for 10 years+ , Wedge would have fell in such an obvious trap ??
my feeling is that they started the whole scam together , the 3 of them ...
(the core of the bizz-plan was to make a fortune on everybody's else money , which is at the time what RP is trying to do = buying everything with nothing ...!)
the only one who had REAL and QUANTIFIABLE money was dayjet's guy ...
on the way , he probably understood that the whole bizz-plan was getting nowhere , and since he was the only one to risk assets being in the USA , he chose to pull-out ...
leaving the 2 left to "hold the bag" ...
then the Russian plan plot started to gradually emerge like the only way out ... meaning RP taking more and more importance into the saga ...
ending-up in Wedge being ousted !
but if you look at the story , who is the one of the 2 who got the best outcome of this nightmare ?
Wedge !
off-course , RP in that case is not the most clever ...
but he has nothing to fear in the US !!
while Wedge is free of any responsibilities ...!
planned long time ago , this is my feeling !!
It does seem that there was some disconnect between Wedge and RP expectations. I find it hard to believe that Wedge's abrupt resignation was planned in advance (by Wedge and RP together). And I am still amazed that ETRIC could amass 68% of Eclipse without having delivered the VEB/Russian investment.
Blog F+FMS – Fact and Fiction Management System
Shane wrote … Fred is like all of us who comment here. As individuals we are often wrong, in detail. However, taken as a group, the blog has been 'correct'.
Unlike the OrphanJet, the blog has in effect an FMS … or maybe an F+FMS … a Fact and Fiction Management System.
Many of the contributors find leads and scant supporting info … which by the nature of back channel knowledge is sometimes incorrect, incomplete, or incomprehensible.
But, there are dozens of other contributors that correct the trajectory of the blog … adding facts, squashing fiction, spinning yarns, etc.
Overall, the blog reached each waypoint along this strange journey more efficiently – in both accuracy and resources – than either (apoc)Eclipse or the blind lemmings.
I have heard that most of those folks are using the CrystalBall 496 on a dashboard mount for life guidance.
Stay tuned … displaced employees will likely get more info from this blog than from EAC leadership, the city, or the state.
Could the 68% include a buy-out of Wedge's (and/or others) interest in Eclipse (for a future payment and/or stock in ETRIC)?
Yeah throw enough shit at a wall and something will stick. This is how this blog makes it's journey.
yes , jack ...
that 68% story is really weird !
(only an other topic which doesn't make sens...;-) )
etric at beginning was a minor partner who bought the rights for out of USA paying with a bank-guarantee (why not cash ? why looking for added difficulties in something already so messy ??)
why ?
because no real cash to put in the story ...!
where it start to be real-weird is when using the same guarantee , etirc got 68% ...
off-course , i may be wrong (my crystal-ball is a bit tired ...) but that would be only an other story , weird one ...
like paying with Notes (which at this time have no-value)
and to answer your question :
i wouldn't be surprised at all that Wedge has got part in Etirc , even after being fired ...!
in Lux. to know who is REALLY behind a firm is next to impossible !
(only very few cases where such information is to be known ... this isn't one !)
so it would be like everything else in this saga :
a show , only a show !
give some hints and let all others make their own wrong conclusion ...after all it is only a matter of 3 Billions $ ... ;-)
omsiv :
i do hope that what you want to throw on the wall isn't your plane ..
be careful , you could be right on this as for the "sticking effect" ! ;-)
Fed Up,
It's tough out there...jobs, the economy, Eclipse, Fred...
This should help.
I’m as mad as h*ll
Yeah throw enough shit at a wall and something will stick. This is how this blog makes it's journey.
Eclipse has been a well-run company with excellent management and Vern is the most innocent person alive. Shame must be brought upon those who say anything remotely negative about Eclipse.
9Z
Excellent !
(for a second i thought it was me !)
i watched , went to the window and did as advised ...
i feel better now , i just don't know why the neighbors called the Police ... ;-))
Sure dave. Sarcasm is like a second language to me so I am right there with you.
Hmmm, ahhh, eeeee.
La la la la la la la laaa.
Do re me fa so la te do.
Fat lady, warming up, don't ya' know.
OK, that's a smidgen unfair. But things are moving along in the background. Timing in these matters is never exact, but the next 48 hours will illuminate a number of things for us.
One thing I dredged up from the Bankruptcy Court documents. It's from the Amended APA, Section IX, dealing with Termination of the Chapter 11/Section 363 sale. It provides an exit clause in the event of a delay in closing, and is as follows:-
""(e) By either party, provided the terminating party is not in default of its obligations under this Agreement, if the Closing shall not have occurred for any reason by February 28, 2009."
One way or the other, this 'phase' of the checkered career of Eclipse Aviation ends on Saturday.
Shane
So, we are 5 days away from being 6 weeks past the planned closing date, and are therefore now bumping up against the end of CH-11 as a possibility.
Hopefully the owners are preparing for a CH-7 asset purchase of the needed tools, tooling, inventory and intellectual property to support the aircraft in the wild.
There WILL probably be some fierce competition for these in a CH-7 fire sale, I would expect to see competing groups (e.g., PLG, 60%'ers, current owners, production restart, etc.).
The next phase of this, pending a last minute miracle from RiP, will likely be full of fireworks that will make disagreements here on the blog look like childsplay.
What to bid on and what to avoid, and how much to offer will be a massive challenge.
And that challenge is the kind of thing I love - I am officially throwing my hat in the ring - I will consult for the right combination of money and vision. My knowledgebase and accuracy of vision are in evidence here and on the original blog - batter up!
EclipsePilotOMSIV,
I'm pretty sure Dave was being ironic, not sarcastic.
You, however, were simply inaccurate. Shit will almost never stick to a wall, if simply thrown at it.
Don't ask me how I know this, as the answer WILL upset you.
Face it, Roel has vanished, the ETIRC deal is dead and the best you can hope for with your FPJ is a few years of very costly service and support, until the parts finally run out. When they do, this highly integrated little jet will need to be 'highly integrated' with a nearby recycling plant.
Hopefully the price of Au will have risen a bit by then...
Shane
ColdWet,
Send me a link to your new website and we'll all be 'rooting' for you!
Just remember, Wedge only has his FPJ on a 'three year lease' from EAC. Once it goes BK, the lease fails.
Can I be there when you repossess it?
Just to see the look on his face....
Shane
Who is going to reposses Wedge's jet Shane? Possession, as they say, is 9/10's of the law.
I bet he flies it until it won't fly no more - like the owners.
Steps over the next 2-3 weeks will likely determine if this plane is grounded by shortage of parts, revocation of the TC due to lack of adequate support, or the creation of a support network to meet the need.
Fascinating times indeed.
Shane and CWMoR,
Wedge doesn't have his FPJ anymore.
Yes, there are indeed some interesting twists coming...
-burner
Do tell Afterburner......
Did Wedge forget to pay the Pieper?
Sorry, couldn't resist.
When you’re buying up machines, tools, and parts at the fire sale, don’t forget to put a few extra fuselages on your list. When the stress areas, near the stir-fried welds and the “chem-milled” areas begin to crack through, don’t expect the “Bondo” and heavy paint to hold the birds together. And also, put on your list, a big “flat-bed” trailer, to carry the fuselages back to ABQ, for replacement . . . they won’t, then, be safe to fly back to the nest.
gadfly
(‘Best if the failures are discovered on the ground, and not during a flight to some far-off vacation spot, while at “cruise”. And I know it’s “fun” to hear that “oil-canning” pop, when you push in a bulge, here and there . . . but “don’t” . . . each “bulge” only has so many “pops”, until only the paint is holding things together.)
FWIW, I bet structural repair is conventional and straightforward.
Treating the fuselage as an LRU though, now THAT would be disruptive.
It seems almost certain at this point that the 363 sale will fail to close and the EAC assets will be liquidated under chapter 7.
Crystal ball says that if this actually does occur, someone near and dear to our hearts is going to make a run at some or all of the Eclipse assets.
-burner
Since we are closing in on it, who is game for predicting the results of a CH-7 sale?
Let's say TC, FSW, tooling and inventory, whole program, and other.
Keep in mind that Adam and Columbia both sold in-toto for less than $20M each.
And Iridium, which invested more than $6B of OPM, sold out of bankruptcy for $25M.
-burner
Somebody might spend 50 mil to buy up all the assets under CH 7. I'd forget about trying to build more of them, but with 259 / 260 airframes out there, there's a potential to make some money on the maintenance & support side of things.
Cold Fish
“FWIW, I bet structural repair is conventional and straightforward.”
‘Bet “Black & Decker” or “Makita” could come up with a portable stir-fry welder for A&P’s to carry in their tool box.
For that matter, every Eclipse should be supplied with one, along with a couple spare tires. . . . and a small “touch up” can of 3M Bondo (tm) and paint!
gadfly
(And a “plumbers’ friend”, to pull out the dents.)
Eclipse Aviation = Ponzi scheme
OMSIV,
from time to time, I have made predictions, and they have been very accurate.
a few times, I found myself questioning things I did not understand. This could be "throwing shit against a wall" in your terms. Again, I did not predict anything, just asked "dtupid" questions, like "why did EAC not cert the windshield heater, until FIKI, if it worked PERFECTLY" as reported by some owners.
Just threw it out there, and you know what? It stuck. SOmeone reported the windshield cracking was exacerbated by the heater, so the collared it.
This was AFTER a bunch of shit was thrown against the wall, that did not stick - like "EAC chose to do it this way".
A good business person WILL sometimes throw shit against the wall... and in the case of EAC, many folks should have been asking a lot of dumb questions all along. Perhaps they would have discovered that a lot of what was being said was real Shit... the Bull kind.
And Iridium, which invested more than $6B of OPM, sold out of bankruptcy for $25M.
And they took out a Russian satellite
Gad,
FSW is not a field repair possibility due to the tool requirements, and I believe you know that.
My point was that structural repair on the preemie jet should be purely conventional - e.g., stop drill cracks, rivet on patches and reinforcements, etc. To have intended anything else would be truly stupid (and therefore possible but I hope unlikely).
MOTION TO CONVERT
The Note Holders have filed the Motion to Convert to Chapter 7 and a Motion to Shorten.
Do re mi fa so la ti do
Ladies and gentlemen, Beverly Sills
The Note Holders have filed the Motion to Convert to Chapter 7 and a Motion to Shorten.
The secured creditors do a good job of calling Roel a liar. They've learned an expensive lesson. They shouldn't have trusted Roel's dealing nor should they have trusted his word. Now because of that the BK estate has lost much of its value.
Cold Fish
Yes . . . it was all tongue-in-cheek . . . along with “sky hooks”, prop-wash (in the gallon container), and “water line” (on a ‘hundred foot spool).
However, on a serious note, I do not believe it wise to attempt to “stop drill” blind cracks, behind the outer skin along, or near, a weld, nor in an area that has been “chem milled”.
“Stop drilling” in structural sheet metal needs full access to both sides to assure complete integrity . . . and to repair the area. Otherwise, whatever caused the crack may continue in ways not obvious from the outside.
Bottom line: In a semi-monocoque fuselage, conventional techniques are not so “conventional”, and require great care, and patches to distribute loads. From all that I’ve learned, who-ever “designed” the Eclipse, avoided “convention” as often as possible . . . just for the sake of being different. (Or maybe ignorance of practical matters.)
An “anecdote” from Albuquerque’s past: At one time, the police department was using American Motors cars . . . until one day, one was involved in a moderate wreck. The car almost disintegrated . . . and it was found that half the “spot welds” were missing. Some how, I see a similarity.
gadfly
(In all the talk about financially saving the little bird, don't forget that once it leaves the ground, all the money in the world doesn't create "lift".)
I think you'll be able to get some, but not all, parts for the Eclipse in the future. Some planes will probably have to be cannibalized. The avionics are going to be the biggest problem. And Shane, I think you're right about the parts being expensive. How about nearly $4,000 for a battery....OUCH.
By the way, I just re-read Ken Wolf's excellent article "My Torrid Affair with a VLJ". For those of you who don't know Mr. Wolf, he was Eclipse's original "diehard" in a series of advertisements. He made some very good points in his article and, in retrospect, a very wise decision. Anyway, the article is a great read, and available at http://www.mu-2aopa.com/
With what looks like the final act in this play now in the works I want to again offer my sympathies and condolences to those whose jobs appear now to be truly lost.
As before, if you want some help finding a recruiter or looking for specific positions, drop me a line at ColdWetMack@gmail.com.
Be advised that Google/Gmail is having problems today but I will try and help as soon as the system is back up.
God speed.
The singing has started.
A new post is up...
Well done to everyone who stuck with us this far.
Shane
the Russians will offer $17 Million cash for all assets.
No one else will bid.
Vern will be rumored to be affiliated with a bidder, so will RiP (TM CW, thanks, RiP, clever) it will not be true.
There will be a license agreement for support in the US, and it will take 4 years before an EA50 is built in Russia. It will have the G1000, and gain EAS cert, and FAA cert in 2014. Production will be 10per month, and they will sell for $1.85 million in Calendar 2009 dollars.
Almost none will be used in part 135.
The Russians will have 400 people working in the factory, and support will cost around $250 per hour USD or equivalents.
If the Russian do not bid, no one will.
CW will be providing support in one facility in the midwest - you will fly there and wait.
Upgrades to the 260 lucky owners will run $450k to FIKI, and eventually you will get a G1000 for $300k. Except, Ken - his upgrade will cost $550, and his G1000 will cost $400k.
Maintenance will run $350USD per hour on a plan. Except for Ken, he will be paying $500 per hour, just because...
IMO
Post a Comment